Meltdown/negativity thread

[WavetheWheat]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=KVN638 link=topic=1163.msg13065#msg13065 date=1285185627]
eh, he has quite the reputation of just ignoring posts when he knows his response (if he keeps his same tune) will make him look like a jackass. Any post that has logic to it, he ignores and he will respond to another.

Cornish just owned him and he's gonna bitch out like always.
[/quote]Good to see you embrace the new board, Kev. Very phog like post from you here. We all expect better. Really no reason for this type of post here.

[KVN638]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=WavetheWheat link=topic=1163.msg13077#msg13077 date=1285187963]
[quote author=KVN638 link=topic=1163.msg13065#msg13065 date=1285185627]
eh, he has quite the reputation of just ignoring posts when he knows his response (if he keeps his same tune) will make him look like a jackass. Any post that has logic to it, he ignores and he will respond to another.

Cornish just owned him and he's gonna bitch out like always.
[/quote]Good to see you embrace the new board, Kev. Very phog like post from you here. We all expect better. Really no reason for this type of post here.
[/quote]

well when you post the same garbage over and over, in new threads, over and over, then bitch about those threads being merged, just like you did on phog... you get phog like responses.


BTW... if you're going to list all his awards, let's list his faults. Throw in resigned amidst incredible controversy.

seriously, quit doing the same ole' shit. You can't say, 'I TOLD YA SO' after every loss then say, 'Let's wait and see if he's a good coach after a few more games' after every win. It's incredibly hypocritical and annoying. How about waiting to meltdown until you see how this season turns out.

[WavetheWheat]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=KVN638 link=topic=1163.msg13093#msg13093 date=1285189097]

well when you post the same garbage over and over, in new threads, over and over, then bitch about those threads being merged, just like you did on phog... you get phog like responses.


BTW... if you're going to list all his awards, let's list his faults. Throw in resigned amidst incredible controversy.
[/quote]

**AIDZ POSTIVE**

[KVN638]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

lol alright man. You make this board fresh and new. Everyone thinks so.

[Milo]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=WavetheWheat link=topic=1163.msg13075#msg13075 date=1285187882]
Well I have not been on board all day. I guess you probably could have seen that by lack of posting and no visits to chat room, but its more fun and dramatic to say I am hiding from this thread.

None of this is new news, ztella has regaled us with his side of this story before. I personally would like to read/hear unanimous coach of the year in 2007 (Associated Press, ESPN/ABC, The Sporting News, Football Writers Association, Walter Camp Football Foundation, National Sportscasters and Sportswriters Association, American Football Coaches Association, the Maxwell Football Club (George Munger Award), Woody Hayes National Coach of the Year) view point on this story. We already established that ztella believes a "doghouse" existed. So you now have confirmation of what you have already brought up in the thread already? How does this change anything?

I have told you 1000 times for every Jon Cornish there are 3 or 4 that will back Mangino until the day they die. Its just a fact of being a head football coach at any level. You have players that will like you and those that don't. Perhaps the message ztella got during his time on the bench was exactly what he needed to motivate him to excel? Perhaps Mangino underestimated ztella's ability? Who knows? I do know this, if Mark Mangino felt that AT THAT TIME Jon Cornish could help Kansas win football games he would have played him. For whatever reason he chose not to. To believe that Mark Mangino would sacrifice his livelihood because of some made up grudge or fictional doghouse is asinine.

How do you know, did you attend every practice, every film session, every coaches meeting, eat dinner with Mangino while he confided in you all the personnel issues of the team when he was notoriously secretive? I call bullshit. You act like the man is Bear Bryant or something.

Angus was in a doghouse because he is not a very good running back. Many, including on this site, told us all to "look out for Angus" now that he has a chance and is "out of the doghouse" he will succeed. He was let out and he still not very good...something I think we established during his 5 previous years at Kansas.

As for Jon, I have no interest in getting into an internet argument with him as he was a great Jayhawk and a hell of a football player that I cheered for every Saturday, but I leave you with this....Thanks to his time at University of Kansas, Jon can live a comfortable life playing a game; something I am sure quite a few of us would trade places with him in a heartbeat. Without Mark Mangino and without the University of Kansas it is a distinct possibility Jon's life would be significantly different and not have anything to do with playing football.

Thanks. We all appreciate the completely unnecessary statement you use to basically cover up and sugar coat you calling him a liar, a bitter former player, or just wrong in his assessment of a situation he had personal knowledge about, while you sit in the stands every Saturday and make speculation on what goes on at practice, player meetings, inside the training room, and coaches meetings. I'll go ahead and believe ztella on this one, I'd think he'd know more than you. I also think he earned his credibility by breaking the anonymity and answering the question as quickly and plainly as possible without throwing stones. He's broken anonymity, and come out and spoken his mind on a controversial subject, there aren't many who would do that. He also did it without throwing stones and answered as matter of fact as he could. Yes, Mangino gave KU the best season we have ever enjoyed. He did good. Was/is he the greatest, most knowledgeable, awesome coach in the country? No. Did he make mistakes on player ability and judgment? You'd be a fool to say no, because every coach does.

Rock Chalk ztella, thanks for everything you did in Crimson and Blue. Good luck with future endeavors.
[/quote]

[Scotch McAngus]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

You know WaveTheWheat.... I haven't decided if you are a genius or a mental patient. I will update you when I have decided.

[WavetheWheat]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=Scotch McAngus link=topic=1163.msg13429#msg13429 date=1285279331]
You know WaveTheWheat.... I haven't decided if you are a genius or a mental patient.
[/quote]Perhaps that is the genius?

[hackh34]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

I love how the running game shows nice improvement over three games (mostly due to the performance of a true freshman that has shown more true running back potential than last year's leading rusher), a very touted freshman is able to keep his redshirt, a guy that no one thought would contribute much (Sands) shows he might be a long term suitable back up or at least guy that can steal some carries, depth is added to an extremely thin position (LB), and people still bitch and whine about the Toben move. If the running game is struggling (or, if it does struggle in the future), I could understand it.
I'm sorry Toben had to switch positions and I hope the best for him, but there's a numbers game that people love to ignore bitch for the sake fo bitching.

[WavetheWheat]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

Hi Hank.

Toben has made a huge impact at LB. So you got that going for you.

Angus has made a HUGE impact a RB, so the decision to move him to RB and make him a captain proved genius as well.

Nobody will convince me that Toben couldn't be having same numbers as angus/sims....Angus could have already helped us as LB.....but then again he was going to QUIT if we didn't let him be RB....how did we reward this behavior? Make him captain.

[hackh34]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

1. Toben has had a chance to play 1 game at LB. I wasn't making a case that he has made a huge impact. We're one rolled ankle from having guys like Brian Blackwell, Chea Peterman (who is dinged up himself) and Steve Mestan getting significant PT at the position. I'm not saying Toben is better than those guys at this point, but it's a position sorely hurting for depth right now.
2. It is difficult for anyone who has watched Sims and Toben to argue that Sims doesn't have more overall RB skills than Toben does. I'm not saying Toben isn't a good RB (when healthy). Under a specific scheme tailored to his strengths, I think he could be very productive. But, that would require tailoring an offense to his strengths (which Mangino did last year). Sims offers more versatility to the offense. He's shown an ability to manufacture big gains with his movement and vision, something that's important for a team with OL issues.
3. The last time we saw Toben at RB (during the spring game), he was struggling to come back from injury. He supposedly has healed, but none of us know what he looks like at RB now. We heard practice buzz about a lot of players this summer, but little about Toben when he was at RB. It's entirely possible that post injury he's better suited for a position like LB that requires less cutting, and that he's not the RB we all remember from last year. Or it just could mean that it was going to take significant time for him to truly get back to 100% period. People opine on this like they've watched the same amount of practice performance that Gill has.
4. I don't know if Angus was ever meant to be a Big 12 starter at any position. I don't know if his position moves should be judged a success/failure based on how many yards he has. If he provides value as a back up and can steal some carries in a game (like he more or less did against Ga Tech), then I'm not sure what people would want otherwise.
5. Agree that Angus shouldn't have been the captain, but not for the reason you're complaining about. Simply put, need a captain that's on the field. Your "he was rewarded for not quitting" argument isn't logical. You make it sounds as if it was an ultimatum that he delivered to Gill, which is a concept you fabricated. He asked if he could stay on, Gill said sure, he worked hard through the spring and summer (per all accounts) and his teammates chose him as captain. That's why he was chosen captain, not because he didn't quit. But, you're the king of tangents so I won't argue that any more. It'll probably eventually be a moot point anyway. With the losses of Todd, Jake and Kerry, young guys that weren't "typical" captains were going to have to step into leadership positions. I don't really know who should have been captain. Hopefully Webb can continue to develop and mature over the course of the season that he fulfills the captain role (without officially being one) at some point.
6. For the 1,000 time, there is a numbers issue this season and the next two at RB. There is Toben (fan favorite because he was highly regarded and led the team in rushing last year), Bourbon (fan favorite because he's a 4*) and Sims (fan favorite because he was a successful Texas high school player). At some point, a fan favorite wasn't going to get PT and would likely transfer or change positions. Then the rallying cry would be "I can't believe Gill recruited Bourbon as a RB and switched him to LB" or "I can't believe Gill ran off Sims." On top of that, KU might get a recruit like Darrien Miller.
I'm not blanket defending Gill here. I still want to know what happened with the Daily fiasco last week. I want to know if the compliance office screwed up, or if it was the coaching staff. I'm not happy about Gill's response on not calling a timeout to hopefully help the non-USM touchdown get overturned. I'm not happy about time management in general. I'm still troubled by the NDSU effort.
But I'm tired of the consistent logic fails of much of the Gill criticism. The running backs have averaged a healthy 141 yards per game the last two games against quality opponents. Your argument is basically that production could be the same with Toben . Usually, the purpose of criticism is to suggest a decision yielded less desirable results than an alternative. Your criticism is that Gill could have maybe accomplished the same thing if he would have acted differently. What did he do wrong, exactly? Really, is the crux of all of this that is was a bad decision because things might have been as good as they are now?
Again, if our running game significantly falters over the course of the season, I think it's fair to revisit the Toben decision. But it's ridiculous at this point. It's bitching for the sake of bitching. Just like the flawed complaints that Gill is spending significant time making rules that he could otherwise be spent coaching.

[WavetheWheat]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

The other thread needs to be merged with this and bring it back to the gridiron board.

[Evolvehawk]

Re: So, can I have my negativity thread back?

[quote author=WavetheWheat link=topic=1163.msg15012#msg15012 date=1286069531]
The other thread needs to be merged with this and bring it back to the gridiron board.
[/quote]

done

[Joe Norris]

Re: Meltdown/negativity thread

THE MODS HERE SUCK

THIS SITE SUX

el jefe sux

[Evolvehawk]

Re: Meltdown/negativity thread

[quote author=Joe Norris link=topic=575.msg15066#msg15066 date=1286084109]
THE MODS HERE SUCK

THIS SITE SUX

el jefe sux
[/quote]

edited for truthfulness

[WavetheWheat]

Re: Meltdown/negativity thread

This has to be a message board first. Has "hall status" ever been revoked.

Turner Gill's transformation into Terry Allen is almost complete. The only question left for me is will he surpass TA sucktitudeness.