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[Serious] Let's solve the illegal immigration crisis

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  • Originally posted by sean View Post
    Do you care if someone here illegally reports a crime or not? Maybe crime is increasing for them, but wouldn't that be a deterrent from staying? As I read through the discussion, the people who we seem to be concerned about are the people here legally. If they are reporting fewer crimes then it's a win for Americans, no?
    That's a ridiculous conclusion. No, that wouldn't deter them from staying if it's still better than going back, people are capable of choosing the better of 2 bad situations, obviously. How is reporting fewer crimes a win for Americans? It might be a win for those that want to claim illegal immigration lowers crime rates, but that's about it. I would prefer they reported the crime, but understand why they don't, out of fear of deportation. So it's a double whammy problem for them. If they were here legally then they could report the crime, we'd have more accurate numbers and be able to do something about it, and they wouldn't have to fear deportation. I'm all for legal immigration, it's the best option for everyone. But we can only vet and provide resources for so many at a time. We honestly just need more resources for vetting and controlling the flow.

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    • I don't care if crime against illegal immigrants is a deterrent to staying or not, so I'll retract that question (it wasn't a conclusion, it was a question) because it detracted from my larger point about lower crime for American citizens, which you didn't address.

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      • Originally posted by sean View Post
        I don't care if crime against illegal immigrants is a deterrent to staying or not, so I'll retract that question (it wasn't a conclusion, it was a question) because it detracted from my larger point about lower crime for American citizens, which you didn't address.
        Ok, not sure what your exact question is then. is it "If they (legal immigrants) are reporting fewer crimes then it's a win for Americans, no?", cause I thought "they" meant illegal immigrants the first time I read it. And I don't know what you mean by "win". Also, it's not a "win" if they are reporting fewer crimes even though more are actually taking place, which I would assume is not the case, real actual crime rates matter. As I said before though, I'm not that concerned with the crime rates, it doesn't appear to be a problem on the surface, with what limited data we have, I just don't like people stating it as some kind of fact and/or that it is a ridiculous thing for someone to be concerned with. I do wish that the Republican party would stop using "crime rates", as a factor in the "crisis". There are other things that are a bigger concern being that we have more people coming than we can reasonably vet in quick order.

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        • I wrote, "the people who we seem to be concerned about are the people here legally. If they are reporting fewer crimes then it's a win for Americans, no?" And, I see how that is confusing. I meant if American citizens are reporting fewer crimes.

          And, American citizens are reporting lower crimes in metro areas. Assuming that means that crime is actually down, then that's a win. And, crime is down even when the number of illegal immigrants rises in those metro areas. Lower crimes being committed is a win. Many rape crimes are not reported. I had a snow shovel stolen off of my back porch and I didn't report it either. But I suspect these kinds of crimes were not being reported all through the years studied.

          Certainly there are other factors that are not being considered. For example, if a higher percentage of illegal immigrants means that fewer jobs exist for American citizens then that's certainly a disadvantage. If illegal immigrants have children in the school system then that can put a strain on public school budgets as well. But the study wasn't about these other factors.

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          • Originally posted by sean View Post
            I wrote, "the people who we seem to be concerned about are the people here legally. If they are reporting fewer crimes then it's a win for Americans, no?" And, I see how that is confusing. I meant if American citizens are reporting fewer crimes.

            And, American citizens are reporting lower crimes in metro areas. Assuming that means that crime is actually down, then that's a win. And, crime is down even when the number of illegal immigrants rises in those metro areas. Lower crimes being committed is a win. Many rape crimes are not reported. I had a snow shovel stolen off of my back porch and I didn't report it either. But I suspect these kinds of crimes were not being reported all through the years studied.

            Certainly there are other factors that are not being considered. For example, if a higher percentage of illegal immigrants means that fewer jobs exist for American citizens then that's certainly a disadvantage. If illegal immigrants have children in the school system then that can put a strain on public school budgets as well. But the study wasn't about these other factors.
            Ok, yeah, I understand what you are asking now. Yes it's good that crime rates are lowering, but 1 thing to remember is that crime rate != absolute # of crimes (reported). It's per capita, that study specifically. But that study can't know the # of undocumented people in a metro area because they are, well, undocumented. So to me the numbers are meaningless. But we can (sort of, if their guesstimates are close) say that the rates are going down ( a win for americans ), but exactly how much they would have gone down if there were no illegal immigrants, we can't know since we don't know how many there are. Anyway, we're kinda on the same page here and getting into the weeds a bit. Yes it's good that crime rates haven't sky rocketed in these places and continue to trend downward. But we also need to keep in mind the illegal immigrant on illegal immigrant crimes and crimes against an illegal immigrant from a citizen, or documented individual that go unreported if we want to talk about true crime rates.

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            • Originally posted by sean View Post

              Good timing okjay. New Pew Research study being reported today in the NY Times looks at crime and illegal immigrants in metro areas and notes, in part, "A large majority of the areas recorded decreases in both violent and property crime between 2007 and 2016, consistent with a quarter-century decline in crime across the United States. The analysis found that crime went down at similar rates regardless of whether the undocumented population rose or fell. Areas with more unauthorized migration appeared to have larger drops in crime, although the difference was small and uncertain." Much more at the link below. This kind of research is difficult given that it's trying to study and track people who are difficulty to track.

              https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/13/u...-research.html
              So we just tell the family of someone raped or murdered by an illegal, "Its ok, because rates seem to be trending down, although the difference was small and uncertain."

              What a warped fucking ideology you have.

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              • Originally posted by okjayhawker View Post

                So we just tell the family of someone raped or murdered by an illegal, "Its ok, because rates seem to be trending down, although the difference was small and uncertain."

                What a warped fucking ideology you have.
                Why would you tell them that? I didn't make that claim and you projected it onto me and then made an editorial comment based on your strawman argument that was unnecessary. How does that advance respectful conversation? Or does that matter to you?

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                • I believe in the rule of law, and you are fine with hundreds of thousands illegals coming into our country.

                  hard to come together on our differences.

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                  • You have once again put words in my mouth and created a strawman. I am not fine with what you said and I would appreciate it if you would stop trying to drag the conversation into the mud and allow me to represent my own thoughts. I will treat you with this same respect.

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                    • Man in country illegally charged with 11 murders in Texas

                      By DAVID WARRENMay 17, 2019





                      This undated booking photo provided by the Dallas County, Texas, Sheriff's Office shows Billy Chemirmir. Chemirmir, previously arrested in the death of an 81-year-old woman, has been charged with killing several other elderly women whose jewelry and other valuables he stole, authorities said Thursday, May 16, 2019. (Dallas County Sheriff's Office via AP)


                      DALLAS (AP) — A Dallas man previously arrested in the death of an 81-year-old woman has been charged with killing at least 11 more elderly women whose jewelry and other valuables he stole, authorities said Thursday




                      http://apnews.com/876d4dd4ce9e44eea0fb0588d7ec684f

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                      • Don't worry everyone, I bought some of these Trump coins (I can send you one OKJH; just send me a SASE) which gives me a point of contact with God. I'll ask God to build the wall (with spikes on it!) and everything will be just fine.

                        https://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...dnuKtqoFH9YtH8

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                        • Lol okjay. If a guy from Iowa murders 58 people does it make you think Iowans are dangerous? Does it make you concerned about what we’re doing to keep Iowans out of the rest of the country? Do you go online and post messages about other crimes Iowans have committed?

                          I’ll hang up and listen off the air.

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                          • Originally posted by GardArmighty View Post
                            Don't worry everyone, I bought some of these Trump coins (I can send you one OKJH; just send me a SASE) which gives me a point of contact with God. I'll ask God to build the wall (with spikes on it!) and everything will be just fine.

                            https://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...dnuKtqoFH9YtH8
                            LOL!

                            Comment


                            • A fool and his money are soon parted!

                              Originally posted by GardArmighty View Post
                              Don't worry everyone, I bought some of these Trump coins (I can send you one OKJH; just send me a SASE) which gives me a point of contact with God. I'll ask God to build the wall (with spikes on it!) and everything will be just fine.

                              https://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...dnuKtqoFH9YtH8

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by LARPHawk View Post
                                Lol okjay. If a guy from Iowa murders 58 people does it make you think Iowans are dangerous? Does it make you concerned about what we’re doing to keep Iowans out of the rest of the country? Do you go online and post messages about other crimes Iowans have committed?

                                I’ll hang up and listen off the air.
                                There is no mechanism in place or even possible to remove potentially dangerous Americans before they commit a crime. There could be a possibility of preventing an illegal from committing a crime in the US, keep their asses out!

                                if building a huge freaking wall could save 1 grandmothers life, wouldn’t it be worth it?

                                i wonder if one of these ladies would have been your grandmother or mother, if your attitude would be the same.

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