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[Serious] Let's solve the illegal immigration crisis

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  • I've lived within 70 miles of the border for the last 25 years. I've camped near the border, hiked there, done some ecology research there. I don't believe there is an immigration crisis or border crisis. Illegal immigration is far down on my list of things I care about. In my opinion, people who believe illegal immigration is a crisis, something that is pulling down our country, and that a huge wall will play a large roll in solving it have been duped by some very base, vile rhetoric. Vilifying immigrants has been a go-to tactic throughout history, this is no different. Certainly, there are aspects of illegal immigration that can be cleaned up, streamlined, made better, but I don't see it as a huge crisis.

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    • Originally posted by Protist View Post
      I've lived within 70 miles of the border for the last 25 years. I've camped near the border, hiked there, done some ecology research there. I don't believe there is an immigration crisis or border crisis. Illegal immigration is far down on my list of things I care about. In my opinion, people who believe illegal immigration is a crisis, something that is pulling down our country, and that a huge wall will play a large roll in solving it have been duped by some very base, vile rhetoric. Vilifying immigrants has been a go-to tactic throughout history, this is no different. Certainly, there are aspects of illegal immigration that can be cleaned up, streamlined, made better, but I don't see it as a huge crisis.
      Tell that to people who are victims of human trafficking.

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      • Originally posted by EasyDisease View Post

        $25B or whatever isn't that much in the grand scheme of things. I still think it's a waste of money, but no one cares about that anymore. I will not be upset if the man gets his precious wall. It just won't solve anything.

        Fear and anger don't lend themselves to good decision making.
        I object to a giant national monument to American stupidity.

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        • Originally posted by RaiderHawk View Post

          Tell that to people who are victims of human trafficking.
          Pretty glib response. Not everything that is bad is a crisis, as bad as it is. And it could be argued that our immigration policies greatly contribute to human trafficking.

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          • Welp, time to move this to the politics board.

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            • Originally posted by WolfShirtSophomore View Post
              Welp, time to move this to the politics board.
              Why is that?

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              • Originally posted by Protist View Post

                Pretty glib response. Not everything that is bad is a crisis, as bad as it is. And it could be argued that our immigration policies greatly contribute to human trafficking.
                I’m interested to hear that argument.

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                • Originally posted by KUGDI View Post

                  I’m interested to hear that argument.
                  Sure. By not having a more streamlined system for legal immigration and instead trying to "seal the border" it created a system encouraging human trafficking as a way of entering the county. The so-called "war on drugs" created similar systems for organized crime.

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                  • The "easy" answer to all of this is a tamper-proof biometric work ID, a comprehensive (read: universal) e-Verify-type system that every employer has to check before hiring, and heavy criminal and civil penalties for employers/businesses who employ illegals. Literally, seize all of their business assets as products of a criminal enterprise, and throw them in jail. Dry up the jobs and the problem will largely solve itself - leaving federal agencies free to concentrate their border efforts on curbing drugs and human trafficking rather than chasing down migrant fruit pickers. This would be far more effective than any wall and probably far cheaper (though that second part is just a guess as I have no real data to project what something like that would cost). Hell, just divert the seized business assets towards funding the entire program.

                    The sad reality, though, is that neither side actually wants to solve the problem or it would already be done. The right wants cheap labor for their business-oriented constituents, and the left wants to increase their voter base - and both sides want their constituents riled up and coughing up money to their respective parties. This is all just a political shitshow on both sides.

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                    • I can't imagine that democrats want illegal immigration because it increases their voter base since illegals can't vote. They might want increased legal immigration for that reason, although hispanic immigrants vote in disproportionately low numbers historically. The rest of your post makes sense.

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                      • Originally posted by Protist View Post
                        I can't imagine that democrats want illegal immigration because it increases their voter base since illegals can't vote. They might want increased legal immigration for that reason, although hispanic immigrants vote in disproportionately low numbers historically. The rest of your post makes sense.
                        Anchor babies, "pathway to citizenship," amnesty proposals - the "well, they've already been here for so long and contributing" arguments. It's a long game, but it's still the game.

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                        • Originally posted by FrobozMumbar View Post

                          Anchor babies, "pathway to citizenship," amnesty proposals - the "well, they've already been here for so long and contributing" arguments. It's a long game, but it's still the game.
                          Hard for me to believe that current democrats are thinking that far ahead. Both parties seem pretty short-sighted overall.

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                          • Originally posted by Protist View Post
                            I can't imagine that democrats want illegal immigration because it increases their voter base since illegals can't vote. They might want increased legal immigration for that reason, although hispanic immigrants vote in disproportionately low numbers historically. The rest of your post makes sense.
                            *in federal elections*

                            “Undocumented workers” (how dehumanizing is that term, by the way? Sounds like something someone in HR created) are very much allowed to vote in some jurisdictions for some positions.

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                            • Originally posted by KUGDI View Post

                              *in federal elections*

                              “Undocumented workers” (how dehumanizing is that term, by the way? Sounds like something someone in HR created) are very much allowed to vote in some jurisdictions for some positions.
                              I think that's not very common and not something on congressional democrats' radar when forming their positions.

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                              • Originally posted by Protist View Post

                                I think that's not very common and not something on congressional democrats' radar when forming their positions.
                                A handful of jurisdictions let them vote in school board elections. The horror!

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